[-PLASMA]

in reply to: 2015 Endgame Recruiting #7833

Agreed it is very much a floating number for example even though the focus is for endgame players I don’t want to turn down or scare
away anyone in the leveling processes and those players while they inflate our overall numbers shouldn’t affect what we are recruiting
for in endgame for example if we get 10 who are leveling we would still need theoreticly 10 others who are in endgame to still hit the
aim for operation players.

[-PLASMA]

in reply to: 2015 Endgame Recruiting #7832

Hello,
I’d say that a size of 35-50 should meet our needs for the moment, after that we can continue recruiting in a more relaxed manner (casual recruiting). But the actual optimal size is not given only by the absolute numbers, the level and specialization structure being an important factor to be considered. That means that we need a minimum tank/heals members at level 60 for each of the time frames for the said time frame to work.
All the best,
Kara/Amy

[-PLASMA]

in reply to: 2015 Endgame Recruiting #7831

Considering that recruitment for ops seems to have unoffically started on saturday I think that I shall start recruiting via swtor forms and twitch on tuesday evening about 36 hours from this post at which time I will be creating another thread pure for info and progress of said
recruiting as well as a place to send prospective players so that they may have all of the
information up front. I would still like for any background discussion such as mergers to still happen here. I would like to have anywhere between 8-12 people for each time period even if some
are in multiple times. I also don’t know how we feel about the pure size of the guild are we ok with 100+ unique acconts or would we rather have 35-50 (26 atm) or so and be more tight knit and
active.

[-PLASMA]

in reply to: 2015 Endgame Recruiting #7830

Um…

friend (frĕnd)
n.
1. A person whom one knows, likes, and trusts.
2. A person whom one knows; an acquaintance.
3. A person with whom one is allied in a struggle or cause; a comrade.
4. One who supports, sympathizes with, or patronizes a group, cause, or movement:

Literal enough for you? yes Hitler. Although that is an extreme example it serves it’s purpose as when there are two polar opposite
views on a subject, like yes vs no, they both can’t be right . Once again you could very well be wrong in your idea of what is shot
down just because someone dosen’t respond favorably to an idea does not mean it is shot down, as seems to be your view.

I totally agree with you on the voice chat r3, I think we are all fairly easy going and yes we may disagree but I feel disagreements are healthy or more so the fact that we can express ourselves in this manner and not let it affect us out side of the individual
discussion is.

[-PLASMA]

in reply to: 2015 Endgame Recruiting #7829

I appreciate the effort of adding a dictionary definition Zez, “but the dictionary doesn’t know the meaning of ‘friends’…” Sorry, fitting song
quote, I couldn’t help it. My point being, I felt “shot down”… no, that sounds too strong, I’m not nearly that thin skinned… If Bowman had made the
suggestion, based on the responses that it got in return, I would of felt as if he got shot down. You are looking at this way too literal… “denied”,
“rejected”, “not going to happen”, “uh uhn, not today”, “buh bye”, take your pick…

Really? Hitler? This is your example? It’s easy to create scenarios to fit the point you’re trying to make, but have you ever heard some say “Hitler
wouldn’t harm a fly”? That isn’t in the psychiatric ward? This topic is heading out of control… even though you seem to be against being “competitive”
… you win! “Opinions” can be wrong, even if rational, which I just assumed would be understood… And we can’t let feelings get in the way of our
choice of words, because they’ll be “wrong”. Next!

My typing skills are very crappy and extremely slow… “voice chat” is a huge part of my gaming experience. When you’re in a group and engaged in an
intense battle, you need to be able to call out “orders” on the fly. Maybe not for everyone, but I’m willing to bet, the majority. Chatting is an
important social bonding tool. There’s no “tone” in text. I don’t know Zez, real well. Do you think our “disagreeing” has remained civil because
we are just THAT mature? We definitely aren’t immature, but we’ve “chatted” quite a bit at this point. I don’t get worked up about things, and he
doesn’t seem to take everything to heart either. You need to hear someone’s voice to understand that… or spend a really long time getting to
know your “pen pal.” I often text things in guild chat that probably read kind of rude, but I guarantee the person I’m texting to doesn’t take it that
way, being aware that I’m joking. Comparatively speaking our members are pretty darn mature… sure there’s a little adult humor from time to time,
but it’s very minimal. We most definitely DO NOT get into Raidcall to isolate ourselves from anyone, and don’t want anyone to feel left out. In fact
members are encouraged to join in. Even if doing casual stuff, leveling, dailies, in group, out of group, whatever… Raidcall.com, it’s a free
download, then I (Aurthree) have the number, Zez has the number, and I’m sure it’s posted somewhere, or someone could get it from the raidcall page,
type the number in the “search” window, then just “double click” down on the channel where the names are at, and you’re in. ttysoon =)

[-PLASMA]

in reply to: 2015 Endgame Recruiting #7828

Very good conversations happening here, I like that fact that everyone is at least open to new ideas and not getting completely pissed off when something they may not like is suggested. Shows that we have a mature guild which is nice.

If things keep going the way they are with conversations like this taking place and new guys joining like last night then we’ll have to make more room in the SH to fit everyone.

See you in game 🙂

[-PLASMA]

in reply to: 2015 Endgame Recruiting #7825

I’m gonna speak for just for myself here, my desires and intensions I guess.

On Topic 1:
If we were to merge with another guild and and be absorbed into them as it were taking their guild I would probably not be apart of
either I don’t do too well in those situations in terms of getting acclimated with the other guilds members. With that being said let me be clear that I have no intensions of leaving the guild as it is now. I believe this is a decison each individual member would
need to decide on weather the wish to transfer, stay or leave altogether for themselves. I never want to be a part of a guild thats
competitve and that is not what I’m aim for here. I want to be a part of a guild that just wants to have fun and challenge themselves
to clear content whatever that set of content is (all 60 hm fps, sm 60 ops, hm 60 ops, ranked pvp etc).

Topic 2:
Agreed. We don’t need 16/20/24 that is actually a bit to much and a bit of a pain to manage. The aim is groups of 8 for ops and to
get to a point were we don’t need to fill spots from fleet, rishi or yavin chats although there is nothing wrong with half guild runs
for example the last few weekends me, bow r3 and telleste have been organizing ops with pugs and trying to nail the first boss on
tython for r3 but it is much better to run with as many guildies as possible during especially with how challenging some of the
bosses in 3.0 compared to how they used to be.

Topic 3:
I Disagree that those tools, (which BW is supposedly working on btw) make more sense for mergers as I believe the same issues as to
why a merger would happen are still there (A dying guild having trouble recuiting find one begining to grow, etc)

Lastly I disagree with that view on voice chat that it should only be used for “setting up strategies during battles” as it is mainly
used for when guildies run group content together and it provides a more direct ability to help each other when questions arise, suchas r3 asking me about upgrading gear last night and allows for those that participate to build a rapport with each other that far outweighs what is built purely through text communications. As always everyone is encoureged to hop in raidcall and join in the
conversation if they so choose even if they don’t have a mic and express themselves through text in guild chat, that works great as
well. All of this comesfrom my experiance over the last few years using voice chat, now granted occasionally issues may arise that
wouldn’t over text and vice versa.

[-PLASMA]

in reply to: 2015 Endgame Recruiting #7823

Hello everyone  🙂
I cannot find the words to express how happy I am to see such an intense discussion on our forum.
I think it is the time to present a more elaborate opinion on this topic.
And, as I see more then one aspects to be considered, I’ll present them by points:
1. As you all well know, our guild defines itself as a casual/social guild. Of course, nothing impedes a casual/social guild to do high level end-game content. Some of us wants this, me included. BUT, some of us don’t want this. In this case, if we will find, maybe, another guild to merge with and we decide that the way the merge will be implemented would be for us to move over to their guild, what would happen with those of us that are not looking for high level endgame content? Will they be left behind? With this case I cannot agree.
Also, maybe it will be the case that those with whom we want to merge will want to come over and join out guild. With the purpose of doing high level, endgame content, of course. Then, we will bring in a very competitive environment which, those members that just wants to enjoy the casual/social part of the game would find, maybe, a bit challenging. This scenario could work, tho, if we are aware of this risk and we take measures in order to prevent it.
2. In order to do high level FP/Ops endgame, we don’t actually need full teams of 16/20/24 players. We need, for each of the time frames of a set of 2 tanks, 2 heals and a bunch of dps. When we’ll have those we’ll be able very easily to impromptu recruit for those specific run the rest of 2 heals + dps we need to form a full team from fleet. Recruiting those is pretty easy and, in SW:TOR, this is how most of the guilds runs theirs Ops. So, you see, we actually have a much more achievable goal for our endgame content recruitment. We did this in the past many times, and we started the Ops run with only one tank and 2-3 dps from the guild … and it went quite well.
3. In a game that provides you with ingame tools for events, raids planning, etc, it makes much more sense to do such merges, as you need everyone to be in the same place in order to be aware of the plans sets in place. But as in SW:TOR, such tools does not exist, we can easily start talking with other players/guilds invite them to our site and start planning a common schedule together (or they can invite us to their site, whatever works). What I’m saying is that in SW:TOR, guild merges might not have the same way of happening as it did in WoW, nor the reasons there were in WoW to justify merges, might not be in here.
4. I’m not ruling out a merge, if you find someone interested, let me know and we will discuss it, what I’m saying is that from my experience in here, mergers usually don’t take place, but I’ve seen many times guilds that splits and then continues to play together as one. Reasons for those splits being usualy either administrative (they reached the maximunm number of 500 players) or economical (the need for more guild storage). Such example of guilds that did this are Doll House Assassins, in which i played for a time (from there are my toons named as letters Beta, Gamma, Tetha, etc)
5. As for the “drama” that you’ve glimpsed just when you joined, that was basically an after effect of a much older drama that we’ve inherited since we were in STO, it sprung when i decided that is the time to put this guild into much more activity and was dealt with at that point so no ghosts from the past to hunt us 🙂 The reason i let it take place in the open was exactly to prove to all of you that we are open and we don’t want historic skeletons to hunt us. Since then, you saw nothing as such.

Bottom line is: I don’t exclude the possibility of discussing about merging, but in those talks we’ll have I’ll make sure to see to the interests of all of our members, even of those that comes in and plays 2-3 times per months and wants to find here, when they log in a friendly and helpful environment 🙂

As a personal note, please be aware that the extensive use of voice communication software, when others are around, gives them a feeling of exclusion. So, please, if you need to use this kind of software for setting up strategies during battles, please limit its use for that 🙂 This is not a must, but a recommendation 🙂

For all concerns please come forward and speak, I’d like to discuss them.

Always yours,
Kara/Amy

[-PLASMA]

in reply to: 2015 Endgame Recruiting #7821

That’s exactly it perspective, an idea dosen’t need to even be considered for to have not been shot down, my opinion unless I
specificly straight up said “no, no way, no how” then I’m not shooting it down
the definition of the phrase from the dictionary:

“shoot down
1. To bring down (an aircraft, for example) by hitting and damaging with gunfire or a missile.
2. Informal To ruin the aspirations of; disappoint.
3. Informal
a. To put an end to; defeat: shot down the proposal.
b. To expose as false; discredit: shot down his theory.”

None of which happened even if you feel that it did. Didn’t put an end to it and didn’t expose it as false or discredit the
possiblity of it happening. What we actually have at the moment is a disagreement of how you felt it has recieved as opposedto how it was intented as can often happen through text. Opinions can absolutly be wrong if I say “In my opinion we have 6 fingers”
or “In my opinion Hitler was an amazing person who wouldn’t harm a fly” am I not wrong? or even my interpretation of the definition
can be wrong, also considering both of us can’t be right on this. However I do agree with you on tomo, he’s a cool dude and it does
fall into the grey area as it’s not quite…I wanna say big enough to be considered a merger but is very similar, assuming he does
actually pull them over.

[-PLASMA]

in reply to: 2015 Endgame Recruiting #7820

As of new developments tonight, I just want to add… “Tomo” just joined the guild, very cool guy and very knowledgeable, who is planning on bringing
I think he said (4) of his guild mates with him. Granted, it’s technically not a “merger”, but falls into a gray area. And no matter how many times you
say it Zez, I’ve never heard of a “wrong” opinion. Your experiences with “mergers” is the opposite of mine, sorry things didn’t go so well for you.
Personally, I didn’t run into any of the issues you did, but I recognize them as potentially possible outcomes. And we must just have different definitions
for the term “shot down”, because unless an idea receives… “we’ll look into it”, “we may consider it”, “that may work”, something that fits in this
category, it was “shot down”. No “right”, no “wrong”, perspectives vary, that’s just the way it is.

[-PLASMA]

in reply to: 2015 Endgame Recruiting #7816

Oh R3 but you are wrong. I disagreed with the with the idea and supplied reasons why they don’twork that I have experianced, not that I am against the idea. You brought up reasons why it could work, I brought the negatives this is the crux of a debate and so
NO it was not shot down, kara/amy even threw an example in where it worked
even tho it’s more of an alliance is on the other side for them with… <Despair> I thinkit was.

You always meet with the guild leader when discussing mergers no if, ands or buts. Once again Iam speaking from what I’ve experianced when I bring these points of doubt or concern up as I’veseen them rip mergers and friendships apart. These very same issues do happen among people
who aren’t precived to be “anti” social as it does take time for most people to be comfortable in new surroundings, I myself am guilty of this even if I haven’t shown it.

I also was…intrigued maybe? by the situation when we first joined but didn’t feel it was my
place to poke the bear so to speak. And again no I disagree, while we are a small guild still Ihave never been in a large guild but have been in ones that tip-toed the line between small andmedium up to about 16 people on during peak times. Could I have been apart of the anomaly? yeahbut my point still stands that it can happen.

To finish this of I’m just supplying my concerns with potential problems of a merger.
The matter is not that i’m against it or that it’s not a viable option it’s just not my place
to actively look for a merger as that should be on the shoulders of kara, plasma, scotty and
londi I believe if they so choose, but what I can do to help the guilds numbers is, with thier
blessing, is to recruit for what I want to do which in case you can’t tell is HM Fps and Ops.

[-PLASMA]

in reply to: 2015 Endgame Recruiting #7815

PS… Sorry Plasma, I meant to comment…

Don’t worry about me, I’m “socially” and “mentally” pretty well adjusted. My attitude on the “recruiting” situation is, I’ve done my fair share
of “individual interviews” and I’ve been a part of “mass invites” (where you have to weed out the undesirables by “kicking” them) and both are
an absolute nightmare, in my book… not to mention time consuming. It’s like, “we’re digging a pool” and someone hands me a shovel, when there’s
a backhoe parked right there… if you want to shovel it, be my guest, as long as it gets dug. But, no worries, anything I’m apart of… I’ll be
involved with. The “recruiting” is just one aspect, there is still much to do… ^_~

[-PLASMA]

in reply to: 2015 Endgame Recruiting #7814

LOL… I like you Zez, and that’s not going to change, but I’m not “wrong”. When I brought the idea up, I received 100% “negative” feedback. I realize
that we were all in game and had things going on, but you didn’t explain “why” you were against, just that you felt there are a number of problems
with a “merger” type of solution, and I was fine with that. I had already anticipated that when you had time, you would explain here and would could have
more of a real discussion about it. But from my perspective, not one thing was mentioned that would indicate that it was even a “possible” solution,
so “yes”, the idea got “shot down”, but I’m okay with it. But I do want to clarify a bit, because based on the replies, we aren’t all looking at the same
picture…

“*Incompatible styles: like bringing in casual social levelers into a raid focused guild and they start to feel alienated out flat out left out by members”…
This suggests we would be merging with “any old” guild. Which is why I mentioned meeting with the other “guild leader”, during which time it would be
determined if we all had similar goals, styles, personalities,… “are we compatible?”

“*Mini Guilds or Sects: Groups of players that communicated among theirselves before the split and after don’t communicate to new people from the merger.
This can cause entire groups to leave or stop playing altogether”…
This is “anti-social” behavior, and not a characteristic of a guild looking to expand. This happens on an individual basis more often than with an
entire guild. This is “why” I constantly bring topics up in guild chat. A team that communicates well, works well together… or “plays” well in
this case. Meeting new people as a group, is far easier than doing it on your own, for most people.

“*Disagreement in Management Direction: Usually starts out all well and good and after time if miss handled or handled without clearly stated direction
from the officers causes people to question things like “what are we really? PvP? I don’t PvP so I’m out” and this in particular is especailly toxic among officers and I’ve seen people who ran things together completely divided on this some will stay some leave occasionally comes along with high drama”…
In my experience, “miss handled” information can break a part a well established guild. In fact, when I first joined this guild, there was some drama
resulting in a founding member leaving. She was really cool, fun to talk to, and she was a knowledgeable player with a great personality. I don’t
know the details of what happened, but it was “drama”… it happens. PvP vs. PvE would be clearly explained in the interview of the leader.

You are absolutely right. All these things are potential destroyers of guilds, but really have nothing to do with a “merger”. They are far more
common in “large” guilds. We have less than (10) really active players. Seeking out a guild in a similar situation, would add lets say another (10)
in this fictitious scenario… Our size would double, and we would still be small enough to avoid large scale drama, but we could start doing
more stuff.

How I approached it in the past, as a guild leader… “LF small personable guild. Raiding experience prefered, but not necessary. Looking to be social
without large scale drama. Pst if you want a good player”… Bait them in and make a proposal. Potentially double the size, one interview. The guilds
that I successfully merged, were larger than what we are working with here. They had about (20) active members each, which isn’t enough to do 25man
content, so by WoW standards they were small. But I don’t see any reason it couldn’t work here. I like the members we have now, I’d like to get
into more content, but if that doesn’t happen I’ll just work on my Stronghold all the time, and trade decorations with Plasma. =)

[-PLASMA]

in reply to: 2015 Endgame Recruiting #7813

Thanks for posting Zez, I agree that all of the issues you raise are possibilities with any type of merger.

As for the chat channels, I’ll have to look into it again, the last 2 times we created custom channels they were reset. However my concern with SWTOR channels is even if they were permanent, getting every guild and alliance member to add the channel on all of their characters in order for them to keep in touch would be a monumental undertaking.

[-PLASMA]

in reply to: 2015 Endgame Recruiting #7812

I didn’t really go into too many details in game but from my experiance issues i’ve seen are:

*Incompatible styles: like bringing in casual social levelers into a raid focused guild and they start to feel alienated out flat out left out by members
*Mini Guilds or Sects: Groups of players that communicated among theirselves before the split and after don’t communicate to new people from the merger. This can
cause entire groups to leave or stop playing altogether
*Disagreement in Management Direction: Usually starts out all well and good and after time if miss handled or handled without clearly stated direction from the
officers causes people to question things like “what are we really? PvP? I don’t PvP so I’m out” and this in particular is especailly toxic among officers and I’ve
seen people who ran things together completely divided on this some will stay some leave occasionally comes along with high drama

These are the big 3 that i’ve seen. Alliances seem to work a bit better but, it’s much harder to manage effectively, I would imagine more so with an international
guild or guilds. With that being said your wrong plasma they don’t reset after each update they may have used to but, on my other server I have been using them for the past 2 years and have not had an issue with it. Now even with my with all this I have been apart of ones that worked even while experiancing all of these issues

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